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Joined 3 years ago
Cake day: July 16th, 2023
  • They didn’t concede Crimea. They failed to get a security guarantee from NATO or the EU and now that would involve declaring war, so we are instead content to watch hundreds of thousands of them die. You need peace before you can get a security guarantee, and the only way to get peace is through some negotiation. Barring the aforementioned spontaneous collapse of Russia.

  • I’m not taking the tankie position but how does Ukraine/Europe/NATO etc. expect to end this war? Do they really think Ukraine will retake the Donbas and Crimea? To me the compromise seems pragmatic and has nothing to do with supporting Russia.

    EDIT: Ok just to be clear. There are three positions.

    1. Fight Russia and push them out of the Donbas. This would involve committing Western troops and declaring war on a nuclear power.
    2. Negotiate and let Putin take some territory. Given the war crimes and fascism shown by Russia, this would be catastrophic for the people who live there, but the daily slaughter would stop.
    3. Give enough aid to Ukraine that the fighting continues indefinitely but neither side wins. This is the current situation. Between 1 and 2 million casualties so far.

    I’m sorry that none of these are great options but dismissing #2 comes off as incredibly callous and naive.