“oops” – Israel
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- 7 days
Too bad that won’t stop them from bombing and killing civilians. I wouldn’t be surprised if they had memorandums about the water quality going up if everyone in Gaza was dead so they wouldn’t produce more waste.
- 7 days
I get that Israel basically learned from WW2 Germany how to be evil for evil’s sake…
But if they want to settle on the ground, why would they literally bomb sewage treatment plants, resulting in contamination of the coast and the underground aquifer (this is the actual damage), which they both intend to use themselves for getting drinking water from?
It just doesn’t make any sense.- FishFace@piefed.socialEnglish7 days
I don’t think either thing there is what’s going on, and I think ultimately it is possible to make sense of things. Israel’s main motivation is neither “evil for evil’s sake” nor Lebensraum; it’s fear and hatred. Actually I think Germany also wasn’t really evil for its own sake; they were also more motivated by hatred.
Maybe the difference sounds academic but it’s not - people who want to be evil for its own sake can’t be denazified/whatever the name that will be given to removing the hate from the Israeli regime. Some hateful people, however, can still be brought back to humanity by promoting empathy.
Israeli Jews generally (obviously not all) hate the Palestinians for October the 7th and previous attacks going back decades. It doesn’t matter to them what Israel has done to Palestinians before or since - they have been attacked, they suffered, they want a) to prevent it happening again and b) revenge. So questions of “how will we use the land if we bomb it to smithereens” are not even secondary, not even tertiary, they come way down the list of priorities.
There are two smart Israeli takes on this:
- You don’t win security by enacting ever greater atrocities against your enemy - that just ensures their children hate you forever
- Actually, you do win security by enacting the greatest atrocity imaginable, because if there are no Palestinians, there can be no threat from Palestinian attacks.
Clearly some evil people in the Israeli government subscribe to option 2. Very few people subscribe to option 1. Sadly, option 2 does actually make sense if they can pull it off before the world gets off its ass.
So the evil is not for its own sake - it stems from the fear and from the hatred. Fear of attack creates an incentive to commit the ultimate evil of genocide. Hatred of those who attacked them creates an incentive for cruelty - what you see from Ben Gvir going around and performatively abusing prisoners and so on. These are evil acts, but they do make sense.
- 7 days
Option 2 is my definition of evil. It is what Machiavelli would suggest.
But it also has a non-emotional flaw: other countries’ populations see that evil and hate it. It directly reduces worldwide acceptance of the country itself. Sure, they are immune to kinetic consequences while the US supports them. But the US shows signs of struggle against Iran now. It doesn’t look like their protection is eternal. Drones might one day counter carrier groups like aerial drones countered air bases.
Wouldn’t it make more sense to seek a diplomatic solution - like not treating half the population like cattle and establishing an apartheid state that makes the Dutch blush?And Israel literally has firsthand experience of what it is like being treated like cattle. It hasn’t been that long since the end of WW2. They should know better than to step in the footsteps of the real Nazis. They know exactly what it looks like. Surely, they know that they have become the baddies.
- FishFace@piefed.socialEnglish7 days
Option 2 is unquestionably evil, but it’s not for its own sake. It is instrumental evil to achieve - supposedly - something else.
I think it’s risky to pursue that strategy. As you say, other countries and their citizens really don’t like it. But look at what is happening so far: strong words… from only a few countries. Sanctions… but very limited sanctions, from only a few countries. Netanyahu’s gamble is simply that they can murder and force out the Palestinians slowly enough that nobody makes a big enough fuss while it’s going on, but fast enough that it’s complete before the US realises how monstrous of a thing they are doing.
US protection isn’t eternal. But how much do you bet that it will run out before there are less than 1,000 Palestinians left in Israel? It’s far from a certainty, right? So no matter what you think makes more sense, there will be people - and clearly there are people - who think something else. And it just so happens that they’re in power in Israel.
- 7 days
Everyone can laugh at the irony, but this will be used as a predicate for total control and expulsion.
- 7 days
“We carry water in jerry cans,” said Nas al-Barawi, 34, a mother of five from Beit Lahia.
The irony here is truly remarkable.
According to Wikipedia, “It was designed in Germany in the 1930s for military use…” and “The name of the jerrycan refers to its German origins, Jerry being slang for Germans.”
No further comment.
